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Author
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Topic: 3G Video Phones (UK)
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Lance Wicks
Sr. Member Posts: 83
From: London & Southern England
Since: Feb 2002
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posted 25 February 2003 11:28 AM
   
Hi all,I am interested to here peoples opinions on how the new 3G phones now available in the UK (and presumably elsewhere  ) are going to affect the industry. My immediate thought is "Compatability". MMS (if industry rumours are true) is not looking like it will be successful, will video phones? When? Why? Why not? Hear from y'all soon, Lance
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Lance Wicks
Managing Director
lwicks@quadrant2cs.com
Impartial video conferencing consulting,
project management & services.
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AlanGreenberg
Wainhouse Research Posts: 25
From: Austin, TX USA
Since: Oct 2002
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posted 27 February 2003 10:27 AM
Lance, I'm just returned from the 3GSM World Congress (and a nice extra couple of days down the road from you in Brighton). I am exploring this topic, looking at the middleware vendors and operators primarily, responsible for delivery of still image and video. Compatibility may not be an issue; we'll see gateways from vendors like RADVision and others to address that (though I suppose there will be challenges initially). I think the issues will have to do more with finding applications, and also the human factors issue: if room and dtop system users thought voice-activated camera switching was dizzying at first, imagine how people will feel as users struggle to get comfortable w/ camera-enabled handsets. Having said that, I think wireless is going to a fascinating area in which to watch personal video gain traction. I heard Hutchison has ordered over 1 million video-enabled phones for their upcoming service. What do you and others think?Alan Greenberg
Sr. Analyst and Consultant
Wainhouse Research
AGreenberg@wainhouse.com IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 27 February 2003 11:48 AM
<<if room and dtop system users thought voice-activated camera switching was dizzying at first, imagine how people will feel as users struggle to get comfortable w/ camera-enabled handsets.>>Very interesting thread.
In one word, I think that mobile video will be a catalyst for change in videoconferencing as a whole which I voiced in the IMTC Forum in May last year. It seems to me over the past one year that people who are kind of skeptical about the potential of camera phones are looking at the issue from users perspectives of conventional videoconferencing.Or Business. Maybe we should look at this issue from another angle. For example, more than 10 million camera handsets were owned by mobile phone subscribers in Japan,which means that more than 1/7 of mobile subscribers have camera phones now mainly teenagers and young generations up to early 30s,they do not feel awkward or struggling to be comfortable with the camera phones, they are already natually using it, not awkward in front of cameras.@They are switching their old phones to camera phones. So the market here is like if you do not sell camera phone, you will be out of business sooner or later. Camera has become a standard feature for mobile phones and competition among vendors are now shifting to improving the pixcels of the cameras and resolutions of color displays. Soon, the quality of the cameras will be as equal as that of middle range digital cameras. They are taking still photos, short video clips or video mails, showing them to their friends or family on the high resolution color display or sometimes sending them to others along with GPS locators,mobile internet(85% of the total mobile subscribers are now using mobile internet) They are creating applications not mobile operators or handset makers. I am assuming that they will become sooner or later good users of videoconferencing in ubiquitous environment. Since my 3 year old kid loves being in front of video enabled 3G phone that I have, she now enjoy being in front of set-top video in my office. Sometimes calling me,"Dad, let's do videoconferencing" I don't think that she understands the literal meaning of the word, videoconferencing, but she does not look awkward or uncomfortable in front of video. We may have to also think that it does not always the case that mass market comes after business. Sometimes it may be opposite; the mass market goes ahead of business market.
If people in the mass market start using it a lot, then the busines market will be affected by it and start to grow. It could happen. We never know. I am not sure this is the case for 3G video but worth thinking about it.However, that is what is happening in camera phone market.This could be applicable to mobile video as well. Stories that describe my ideas and my usage of 3G mobile phone: Mobile Videoconferencing to Be 'Ubiquitous' Wireless Surprise - In Japan and Korea,
mobile content is making money
Keis
1:30am Feb.28,2003 JST +9GMT
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Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 04 April 2003 09:17 AM
Looks like DoCoMo sold 100,000 of newly introduced 3G mobile videophone PV2102V just for the past two weeks to both new and current subscribers of FOMA 3G service.It is usually sold at around 33,000 yen or 300USD a handset that has two cameras and you can use it not only videophone but also as like "personal video camera" that allows up to 3 hours of video recording if you use 128MB SD card that can be put in the handset. I just also bought it with a special price at 16,800yen or 150USD. Looks like many people bought it because they liked the design and features. I see that DoCoMo is almost daily running a TV commercial promoting this handset. http://foma.nttdocomo.co.jp/english/index.html TV commercial http://www.nttdocomo.co.jp/museum/cm_gallery/index.html keis This message has been edited by Keisuke Hashimoto on 04 April 2003 IP: Logged |
Spoon
Sr. Member Posts: 73
From: Other
Since: Apr 2003
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posted 11 April 2003 12:42 PM
Must say I have a real interest in 3G. Ultimately with the huge sums already been invested just to be allowed to play in this arena I don't think the network providers can afford to let this fail.In the UK alone the 5 successful license holders paid over $30bn, and all they got for their money was a piece of paper. One has to guess that they will be prepared to spend at least the same again, so even if consumers don't get it now they will be so bombarded that it'll probably take off anyway. If in doubt look at Pepsi and Coke Cola for an example of marketing over substance. Thoughts ??? IP: Logged |
Spoon
Sr. Member Posts: 73
From: Other
Since: Apr 2003
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posted 11 April 2003 12:44 PM
Oh and just as an aside, GPRS and other 2G and 2.5G technologies didn't cost anything like as much for the providers to roll out and therefore there is a much lower compelling reason for them to make it work.IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 13 April 2003 02:13 AM
I read news reports here in my country that operators in Europe paid huge amount of money to get 3G licenses. It was certainly beyond our understanding as Japanese perspective. Looked that your governments were trying to discourage operators to launch 3G services from my point of view. From your perspective, Spoon, I am sure that you must make the 3G service successful. So as DoCoMo and J-Phone in Japan,however. However, whatever it is, I found my 3 year old daughter loves being in front of my 3G video mobile phone enjoying someone on the display talking to her directly. I am sure by the time when my kid grow up and start working for a company, she must be using this kind of video communications tools as natuaral as phone and fax and emails. We now have "PV2102V" on the market, compared with the previous model, we saw an improvement in the display and battery life along with service coverage. Since they are using TFT display on "PV2102V", the quality of images and pictures are much better as the previous models use STN display. DoCoMo looks trying to improve the bandwidth available for 3G service. Currently 384kbps is available for data, next year, they will be making it more than 10Mbps. As for mobile video, they are using Mpeg4 format with 64kbps switched circuit, so along with the 10Mbps, if they are going to improve the bandwidth allocated to mobile video to at least 384kbps. The quality of mobile video will be much better. People around me say that 64kbps is not enough, very cheap quality of video. I agree to that opinion. keis
15:15,April 13,2003 JST This message has been edited by Keisuke Hashimoto on 13 April 2003 IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 13 April 2003 02:25 AM
I think that if service coverage is more than 90% in terms of population, users will look at the design of handsets and features(as for PV2102V, mobile video camera, and 2 cameras built-in, SD card), not at applications and technology behind.They will look at the design and features of the handsets on the market. If they think it is "cool", they will buy one. So handset makers must be looking at the importance of creating good designed handsets with interesting features. Then people will buy one and they themselves will create applications. Seems to me, operators in Europe and North America have put more emphasis on technologies used and applications etc.. not looking at the design and features of the handsets. keis This message has been edited by Keisuke Hashimoto on 13 April 2003 IP: Logged |
MikeP
Sr. Member Posts: 107
From: Tracy, CA USA
Since: Jan 2001
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posted 15 April 2003 04:21 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Lance Wicks:
Hi all,I am interested to here peoples opinions on how the new 3G phones now available in the UK (and presumably elsewhere ) are going to affect the industry. My immediate thought is "Compatability". MMS (if industry rumours are true) is not looking like it will be successful, will video phones? When? Why? Why not? Hear from y'all soon, Lance
So how does a 3G videophone work--> How does a person call another person (or is it just as obvious as I think it is)? How does the phone decide if it is just a telephone call or a video call? Is this purely switched services or is there an IP component in here? If so, how do the gatekeepers handle 3G phones and calls? What protocols are being used for video and for voice? Thanks, Mike IP: Logged |
Spoon
Sr. Member Posts: 73
From: Other
Since: Apr 2003
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posted 16 April 2003 03:32 AM
Mike,Don't know the answers to all your questions, but think I know some people who do. Try talking to RADvision, they seem to have a H.324m to H.230 / H.323 gateway. H.324M is the standard for VC over mobile and it is as you suspect IP based. IP: Logged |
Harry
Member Posts: 22
From: Florida
Since: Apr 2003
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posted 16 April 2003 03:27 PM
Dear gentleman,
The question is not weather their is a market or and app. .The markets for VC are obvious and wireless VC is even more appealing. A picture says a thousand words. Bet you have herd that before. The cell phone companies have already established that there is a market its called 3G and it is BtoB Btoc and CtoC. Once the infrastructure is ready for 3g the wired video companies will have big problems. They must act now! The Questions are what hardware do we use what standards and what infrastructure. The other big thing is how do we make it easy enough for every one to use not just techies or your It department .It also must not be a computer peripheral lots of people dont like computers but they still want to be able to communicate with others and video would be great if it worked easily. It must be an all-inclusive device, not plug this into that then get the ip# and maybe it will work, if the setting is right and the wind is blowing from the south. Everyone use phones even grandma because it is simple and it works the first time all the time with no adjustments. Vc nor 3G currently work easily. In order for VC to become mainstream, and VC must become mainstream to survive. VC must become just like a phone or a cordless Phone that includes video. It must have dedicated hardware. It must be full motion and color. It also must be in a form factor that suits the application and they do vary. I Have the solution to all of the above and can demonstrate it, its scalable and its real, and it can be deployed now. Dont waste your time on all these people who have theories on how it could be, come see it work today. All's it take's is cash and its yours. I will show it to qualified companies only. I will not disclose how it works until a deal is in place so dont ask. My phone # is 239-455-1411 ask for Harry. My email is imrc@imrc.net //www.imrc.netWe also own the IP. Now is the time to get involved in this opportunity dont wait till your competition does.
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AlanGreenberg
Wainhouse Research Posts: 25
From: Austin, TX USA
Since: Oct 2002
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posted 16 April 2003 04:07 PM
Harry, if you want to solicit customers that's okay. This is an open forum per the agreement people sign when they join, and you're doing it more or less appropriately within the context of the thread. But in the spirit of the forum, how about telling us what types of networks you're building for, and what standards you're using in building what looks like, from your website, to be an interesting handset? You may say you don't need to talk the talk but those little details would go a long way to tell people if you can walk the walk. (You're not likely to get a response based on what you have so far.)IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 18 April 2003 07:34 PM
<MikeP:So how does a 3G videophone work--> How does a person call another person (or is it just as obvious as I think it is)? How does the phone decide if it is just a telephone call or a video call? Is this purely switched services or is there an IP component in here? >My 3G mobile videophone has two bottoms one for audio call and another for video call, so if you want to make a video call, you press destination number and press "video call" bottom. My videphone picture is available at below url. http://foma.nttdocomo.co.jp/english/term/p2102v_01.html And you see, there is a green botton just above a bottom that says "1", this is for audio call. and you might find another small green bottom just below a bottom that says "#". This is for a video call. So depending on a call you want to make, you choose either bottom. And as for incoming call, my handset looks automatically recognize which call(either audio or video) is coming in. And as for the network used, it is fully curcuit switched based. As for gateway,I have seen a demo in Tokyo where Radvision and their Japanese partner showed interconnection between this 3G videophone and H.323 based Netmeeting. keis IP: Logged |
Spoon
Sr. Member Posts: 73
From: Other
Since: Apr 2003
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posted 27 April 2003 06:18 PM
Harry,Errrr, mate if you want to make a huge amount of money then you better let the rest of the world know the OBIVOUS reasons why mobile video is going to be worth the massive investment. The lesson of history is that video technology has not been of much interest in Europe, neither have data services. Don't know what your beef is with the 3G market your product seems to fit a completely different market. Real same the US never got on board with GSM really would have made it so much simplier to get one standard going 10 years ago, then the world could move together to the next step. Another case of not invented here syndrome me thinks. IP: Logged |
jesper stuhr
Member Posts: 10
From: Copenhagen, Denmark
Since: Jan 2003
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posted 28 April 2003 02:56 PM
Hi Lance (Copenhagen replying!)I am not sure about the 3G phone. Consumer wise it is a interesting item. A PLAYTOY. But a B2B item for visual communication, I would never expect. Visual is about SEING. Who can enjoy a 2 by 3 centimeter view, who need to participate in such. A Group4 guy can supervise "on the fly" removing the high cost of a monitoring central, that is what I see as potential. But a real video conference, where one is using a 3G phone, I am not sure it will be a hit. I trust that 3G phones can also provide more "reasons" for the service industry. Another endpoint has come, and it should catch up as another reason for subscribing on a conference service. So for the industry it can be a aditional endpoint. But the visual quality I never think will justify the actual use - beside the above transfering a visual security view on Shop X on Z street, where the alarm has just started.
Jesper S.
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jesper stuhr
Member Posts: 10
From: Copenhagen, Denmark
Since: Jan 2003
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posted 28 April 2003 03:19 PM
DOCUMENTATION:
Your car gets hit. Use the 3G phone to send a visual documentation to the insurance. In any situation where you write a damage report - based on history you send it by mail, it is evaluated, questions asked, mailed back - and finally one day, you have a result, your damage claim is paid, or rejected. This process can be reduced to INSTANT solutions over 3G.It can be THE TOOL to move our documentation from the old ancient way of writing to visual providing HARD FACTS and getting INSTANT REPLY and RESULT. Think about the insurance companies, what they can save on handling damage claims. That is for me a potential business over 3G. But it all comes down to the motto from GHOST BUSTERS with their slogan: "who are you gonna call"...... IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 03 May 2003 10:38 AM
Remember, jornalists reporting from war going Iraq were using videophones to report to their press headquarters etc...
The same kind of thing can be done as well for 3G mobile videophones.So that jornalists do not have to carry heavy video cameras etc.. 3G videophones in their pockets anytime.Anytime they find some accidents or crime taking place right in front of them, they can show the scenes live directly to news center. But before that we need to see improvement in the quality of video. And the handsets need to be tailored for such use. Talking about application of 2.5G camera phones available in Japan, camera phones are used to capture crime scenes and send it to police crime report center. But unfortunate thing is that some criminals are using camera phones to take snap shots of girls from under their skirts and get arrested for example. It has become a social problem already in this country where about 30% of mobile phone subscribers are owners of camera phones. If you are just looking at the current level of mobile videophone in terms of technology and design etc.., you might think it is a toy, but do you think that it is going to be so forever. Everyday we see the development and improvement of technology. I am sure 10 years from now the whole world surrounding the 3G mobile videophone will be totally different. By then, we should be calling it 4G,though. We should keep running and moving our thinking process forwards, otherwise we will not be able to see any improvement or advancement in our communication lives. keis
23:40 May 2,2003 JST +9GMT This message has been edited by Keisuke Hashimoto on 03 May 2003 IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 03 May 2003 10:50 AM
I don't understand people just saying that 3G mobile phone is just a toy and stupid thing?Why do you say that? The product is just at the early stage and nothing is perfect from the beginning. I think that it will be another way to communicate with others allowing us to have more choices in communication tools. I just do not understand people simply denying the potentiality the 3G mobile phone may have towards the future. And how can you be so sure that it does not have any future? Keis IP: Logged |
AndyN
Wainhouse Research Posts: 345
From: Sarasota FL USA
Since: Jul 2000
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posted 04 May 2003 06:04 AM
Interesting quote from John Dvorak's Inside Track column in the 27-May issue of PC Magazine:
quote:
Do I need videoconferencing on my cell phone? If I hold the phone far enough away that the other party can see me clearly, then I can't see the little screen. It's pointless.
I can't say I agree nor disagree at this point; rather, I do think John's opinion is probably typical of North America. Consider it a marketing data point ...AndyN
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Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 04 May 2003 08:06 AM
That is fair enough. Needs difference. Some people need it but some other people are not interested in it.But I just wandered if he has already tried out mobile videophone in his life to see how it goes, and thought about technological improvement towards the future such as quality of the video and screen itself, and also wandered if he has ever thought about it from a point of view that what is needed to make this mobile video reality and actually work. keisuke
21:05 May 4,2003 JST +9GMT IP: Logged |
AlanGreenberg
Wainhouse Research Posts: 25
From: Austin, TX USA
Since: Oct 2002
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posted 04 May 2003 10:25 AM
I'm in Keisuke's camp--to the extent that I believe it's going to be more than a toy. I think there's a carryover bias against video in general, a belief that it's taken traditional videoconferencing such a long time to gain acceptance, it's making people (perhaps in certain markets) want to be sure that the newer wireless 3G video technologies are more than "toys." The mainstream press in North America, as an example, has enjoyed bashing two-way video for years while rarely taking the time to understand the applications, the vertical markets, and the productivity improvements that organizations can experience. Time will tell but it's coming because the networks and the devices are coming...IP: Logged |
Spoon
Sr. Member Posts: 73
From: Other
Since: Apr 2003
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posted 05 May 2003 10:20 AM
Alan,Another thing to consider with 3G mobile video is the idea of the other end seeing what you see not you. IE. look at the building site, crashed car, patients spots. IP: Logged |
AlanGreenberg
Wainhouse Research Posts: 25
From: Austin, TX USA
Since: Oct 2002
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posted 06 May 2003 09:12 AM
I agree, Spoon. The analogy I'm growing increasingly fond of is this: how often do you think or have time to remember to carry a camera with you. (No one expected disposable cameras to find a market either, btw.) I used the term 2-way vc as an "umbrella" term but agree, the advantages of showing other things will be a major attraction.IP: Logged |
Victor
Sr. Member Posts: 65
From: UK
Since: Sep 2002
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posted 08 May 2003 05:48 AM
Consider this....
Your 3G phone becomes a dockable unit, like an iPAQ. You go into the office and you can dock it with your PC, you then use the PC for the image, more interestingly, you get into your car and it docks there as well. The screen for the sat nav also can display video and content (remember content is probably the biggest $ revenue they will get for 3G).
If you are stopped it can make a video call. When you are in a new area and want to find a bank or a takeaway etc you gan easily get that information sent to you.I think it is not going to be one application that makes something like 3G great, but more importantly how people integrate 3G type technologies into existing areas to create higher levels of service and improve.
Inherently the Human race is lazy! We expend more energy on finding ways of making things easier than we do on doing those things!
We will and do pay for services and items that mean we percieve that we have made life easier for ourselves.
Lets be honest.....email and mobile phones have made things easier, but also they have become a pain in the butt!
You cant escape the mobile and email is becoming a SPAM monster rather than a means of communication.
Could be a great kick start to get the desktop VC market flowing again IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 10 May 2003 11:50 AM
DoCoMo recorded the yearly revenue of 4.8 trillion JPY(40.8billion USD) for the fiscal year 2002 ended at last March.
And income before tax is 1.05 trillion JPY.(9billion USD)The capital expenditure for the year was 854 billion JPY(7.2 billionUSD). They spent 243 billion JPY(2billionUSD) for
their employees' salaries etc..(5794 employees). ARPU for subscriber is 8120 JPY(70USD). Audio ARPU is 6370JPY(54USD), mobile data ARPU is 1750JPY(15USD). And their 3G service is picking up covering 91% of population and reaching 420,000 subscribers. And every handsets they will
sell from now on will be video enabled as they looks they sold almost 200,000 video enabled 3G phone for the past couple
of months. And it is said that they will be putting out couple of more video enabled handsets models this July and more in the fall.
They also sold 9 million camera phones for the past year in 2.5G service. Some people who bought this recent video enabled phone said that the handset is something that gives you fun to own it.
They bought the handsets because they liked the design and they liked video camera capability that allows you to record up
to 90 minutes of video etc.. They will not the instant video users, but these people are certainly potential user of video communications in the near
future once the number of video enabled handsets users reach 5 million, I am assuming that mobile video will break. I do not feel it will be tough number as long as you create good designed handsets with decent features that give you
fun to own it. It does not have to be video capability to attract potential buyers, but it can be any thing like video camera
capability or design or something. We have to make people buy one anyway and sooner or later people will notice that "oh, my handset has video capability,
and my friends' handsets too, let's try it." Visual communciations has to be fun like my 3 year old kid loves saying "videoconferencing" and playing with
the keypad of my set-top video and having fun with my 3G video mobile phone. I am assuming that when my kid grow
and become working in offices and she may say, it is fun to have a video meeting, why don't we do this in office as well?
It could happen to our kids in the future. My assumption is that visual communications will break first in consumers not in business. Business will come after
consumers unlike the norms we belive in. Business first consumers next.I may be wrong but who knows. keis
This message has been edited by Keisuke Hashimoto on 10 May 2003 IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 02 June 2003 01:02 AM
DoCoMo just annouced that every 3G handsets that will be introduced into the market from this summer will be all video enabled.The weight of the handsets will be around 110g/110cc with standby time going up to 300hours equal to the current 2.5G handsets available in Japan. In addition, 3G PC card put into PC card slot will be also video enabled, which means that if you install software supplied by DoCoMo along with PC camera, you can have a 3G-324M video communications with 3G handsets. May be another Japan only phenomenon again? Keis IP: Logged |
czoli
Sr. Member Posts: 1469
From: italy
Since: May 2003
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posted 03 June 2003 01:55 AM
Hi there, interesting topic.I have in my hands a Radvision GW-P20M. It is a chassis with 2 cards: classic GWP20 card + VPSM. It is an H.323 <-> H.324M GW supporting transparent H.263 and H.263 <-> Mpeg4 Xcoding, about audio it s a G.711 <-> AMR (6 rates supported). Actually the 3G world is a mess with mobiles not working so good. As far as I know the good EPs (3G) you can find in europe are the Sanyo and the NEC. Motorola was phased out by "tre" (Italian H3G, btw it is far more successful in ITaly naturally than in UK). LG and Samsung phones seems to be quite broken. Anyway it does not seem worth running to buy one of those 3G systems. Anyway I tested Polycom ViaVideo (IP side) with NEC (3G side). The video naturaly is QCIF but it is not so bad considering that the call on the H.324M side is only at 64 k! I would say that it is quite good for that speed.
This message has been edited by czoli on 03 June 2003 IP: Logged |
jesper stuhr
Member Posts: 10
From: Copenhagen, Denmark
Since: Jan 2003
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posted 03 June 2003 07:58 AM
It looks like my word "toy" caused comments. I need to point out, that I LOVE visual communiation. But I wonder if for B2B a screen on a 3or4G phone will ever be enough for a serious visual "talk". I have no doubt, that video-"talking" is the future communication form, It started on a wire, telex, telefax, e-mail, next stop is VISUAL communiation in many forms, among them over mobile video phones. But I happen to think that visual "talk" over a mobilephone have VISUAL limitations. Content and possibilities in where to use the mobile video phone is another question. Visual documentatation, private "hi how are you", but participation in a business meeting over the mobile phone using the video, I am still not sure - due to the size of the "screen" = display:-)
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stevechen
Member Posts: 19
From: Bellevue, WA
Since: Mar 2003
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posted 03 June 2003 07:57 PM
Hi CZoli;China Unicom has 200K CDMA network. I am interested in knowing more detail on what do you test on NEC (3G side)? quote:
"Anyway I tested Polycom ViaVideo (IP side) with NEC (3G side). The video naturaly is QCIF but it is not so bad considering that the call on the H.324M side is only at 64 k! I would say that it is quite good for that speed."
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czoli
Sr. Member Posts: 1469
From: italy
Since: May 2003
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posted 04 June 2003 01:55 AM
I work in the Videoconference so my target is to have a LAN to WAN and WAN to LAN Videocalls working.The Radvision GW is used to connect H.323 endpoints with 3G mobiles. BTW I am not a Radvision developer, I test the functionality of the product. As said the GW support H.263 and mpeg4 and G.711 xcoding to AMR.
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stevechen
Member Posts: 19
From: Bellevue, WA
Since: Mar 2003
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posted 04 June 2003 02:53 AM
Hi CZoli;Does it require that wireless carrier to support NEC H324M Mobile Video phone when you make this demo test. If wireless carrier have 200K 3G CDMA network, do you think the quality is the same as IP Vidoe phone. quote:
Originally posted by czoli:
I work in the Videoconference so my target is to have a LAN to WAN and WAN to LAN Videocalls working.The Radvision GW is used to connect H.323 endpoints with 3G mobiles. BTW I am not a Radvision developer, I test the functionality of the product. As said the GW support H.263 and mpeg4 and G.711 xcoding to AMR.
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czoli
Sr. Member Posts: 1469
From: italy
Since: May 2003
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posted 04 June 2003 05:06 AM
I did the test with H3G.H.324M is a way to reach a wireless carrier using ISDN. the carrier must be connected to the ISDN world to make its phones able to receive/place calls with POTS. If the carrier does not block H.324M calls by defualt you can call a 3G mobile using the Radvision Gateway like you do with the regular H.323/H.320 GW. On the 3G side you just do a Video Call but instead of calling another 3G mobile you call the number of the GW which will route the call to the IP Endpoint (Netmeeting, Polycom.. whatever) using DID, IVR .. Actual mobiles should be interoparable with each other but it is just a matter of taking in account that are new products, the NEC is one of the best ones today. H3G started with NEC after considering that it was the best one. If you need further details you should contact Radvision. IP: Logged |
jesper stuhr
Member Posts: 10
From: Copenhagen, Denmark
Since: Jan 2003
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posted 04 June 2003 07:09 AM
I sence there are some experts in the forum about 3G phones. A open question: I have asked a large mobile distributor in Europe, to consider the video conference business as well. My point has been that 3G (and 4G) will make the service part interesting, offering clients a value add service (video server) handling communication between 3G phones and any endpoint. Our local PTT is still running a service on MCUs through ISDN lines and do not see any need for expand to IP!!!! thanks JSIP: Logged |
czoli
Sr. Member Posts: 1469
From: italy
Since: May 2003
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posted 04 June 2003 07:50 AM
I agree that videoconference on 3G phones is something cool.The main reason is that it is a natural evolution of the wireles service. It is possible today to have an IP MCU (so H.323) plus an ISDN GW (H.323 to H.320) and to multiconferences over IP, ISDN and mixed. If you just add to the mix an H.323 to H.324M GW you end up with a system able to do multiconference for 3G phones as well (the H.324M will route the calls to the H.323 MCU). It is something really interesting. Actually when a lot of ppl will have 3G videophones they will want to call thier Boss in the office and do multiconference as well. Just a imagine a big company which is used to multiconference and thinks that it is really useful, if the add a GW like that in their network they will be able to dfo videoconferencing with sales ppl on the road. someone is wondering if 3G videophones are useful or not I think that it is just another way to do videoconferences. If you already use it and you like the tool you will probably find them useful too. It is just a matter of time. The big revolution will be when 3G videophones will totally or mostly replace the regular systems (room systems). This is something that it will not happen considering that the experience for the use is different. The market is also moving to videoconference over IP but as a true pervasive tool (read it as: videoconference on every PC, windows messenger?) Sorry for my poor english. This is an interesting discussion! let's keep it moving. This message has been edited by czoli on 04 June 2003 IP: Logged |
jesper stuhr
Member Posts: 10
From: Copenhagen, Denmark
Since: Jan 2003
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posted 02 August 2003 02:52 PM
I do not think that 3G or even "4G" phones can or will replace video conf. systems for either PC or meeting rooms. Visual communication has VISUAL as the main issue, we can SEE eachother. And the smaller the screen become, the worse will the experience of the meeting be - in my view. Screen-size, lightning etc. makes the difference between a "good" or "bad" meeting. Jesper Stuhr, Copenhagen IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 17 September 2003 07:27 PM
Looks like Hutchison 3G UK and NTT DoCoMo are going to provide international service for 3G mobile videophones so that a onwer of a 3G videophone in Japan can call his or her friend with a 3G videophone in UK via mobile video.
According to a local news here in Japan, it will cost 432JPY or 4USD per minute.
I saw a demo at exhibition show called World PC Expo 2003(Chiba, Japan) connecting Japan and UK via video. English people in UK spoke Japanese via video to attendees at the show.IP: Logged |
Keisuke Hashimoto
Sr. Member Posts: 377
From: Funabashi Japan
Since: Aug 2000
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posted 25 November 2003 11:55 PM
Looks like the subscriber number for 3G phone service by DoCoMo has reached 1.5 million recently which means that almost all of them are owners of mobile videophones and the potential users. They got 500,000 new subscribers for the past 50 days.The increase is accelerating recently due to 96%-99% service coverage in terms of population, handsets much lighter in weight, much better resolution on TFT color display and longer battery life, better design attractive to buyers have apparently contributed to the recent rapid increase in the 3G service subscribers. It may not be so long before reaching 4-5million by the end of the next year, which I assume is a point where it is before dawn for mobile video break. J-Phone/Vodafone is also trying to catch up with DoCoMo and to sell mobile videophones to the market. At this moment, cashcow for DoCoMo is the current 2.5G service, but they will start making a shift from 2.5G to 3G from the next year by putting more resouces into it and eventually making 3G their new cashcow for their business. Probably they will take an approach similar to when they made a shift from analog to full digital during mid-1990s. This message has been edited by Keisuke Hashimoto on 26 November 2003 IP: Logged |
garyhay
Member Posts: 1
From:
Since: Mar 2004
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posted 09 March 2004 07:15 PM
Just dropped in to give a users view on UK 3G services.The UK's only current provider is 3. Handsets have being dogged by problems as has the network and hence users. Compatability issues with MMS means that you can only send to other 3 users and even then it depends on which handset you have. With great promise of faster mobile communications 3 have badly (IMHO) let themselves down by only allowing access to the current 3 services and 3mail but to use the phone as a modem even this requires serious knowledge of how to by-pass proxy settings etc. As I mentioned the handsets have being seriously flawed and since I started using a 3G phone (I have had 3 in 5 months) only in the last month have I had a handset that shows some potential. First handset I had was a Moto A830 and it was great but just could not make a call and sometimes got too hot to handle. It needed 5 visits to a repair centre and was out of action for 90% of the 4 months I had it. Spend most of those 4 months using an NEC e808y and its still the most stable of the 3 phones I have used and holds the signal much better than the others. It's useless as a PDA due to its cranky PC Sync software, which is a shame as its Blueberry style design was a winner with me. Too big for the teenage market. Now using a Moto A835 things are looking slightly better. Handsets (well some of them) in some areas can use A(GPS) to help find a location to within a couple of meters and show a map of how to get where you need to be. Video calling, no need for it really and not enough user base. Still locked into 3 and no internet access or GPRS or WAP and no real content worth anything, 3G is still IMHO, 2.25G. People may say the phone is big but it is a whole bit smaller than an IPaQ but can give most of the functions with only one phone sized package. Thats why use it. 3G its just not happening - Yet ! Hope that helps you guys out IP: Logged |
Victor
Sr. Member Posts: 65
From: UK
Since: Sep 2002
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posted 07 April 2004 12:26 PM
Well, my 2 cents are... big pile of doggie doo. I have had an A835 for three months and have been dogged by problems - battery life is not worth mentioning, charger has become unsafe, phone loses signal after call and wont re-register, if I get a text message the phone locks and I have to remover the battery (now done so often the back of phone just slides off with a little pressure from my thumb) and on top of that it randomly reboots itself which means if I have to check it reguarly to see if I need to re-enter my pin!
The line rental deal is great 500 mins for 25 a month, but if its not connected to a charger then it wont last very long.
So will it take off for video......I dont think so, not for a long, long time.IP: Logged |
AlanGreenberg
Wainhouse Research Posts: 25
From: Austin, TX USA
Since: Oct 2002
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posted 08 April 2004 10:57 AM
Victor et al,Your experiences reported here are fascinating. Let me offer an analogous scenario and ask your opinions. About 15 months ago I bought a Sony Ericsson T68i...with much touted "communicam" attachment (still images), GSM/GPRS, and WAP/internet access. Pictures were "okay" but there were other problems..the web button stuck out like a sore thumb and ended up not working all the time...there was no flash so the pictures had to be taken with much sunlight. Oh yes, and the emailing of photos seemed to be taking place not over GPRS but via slow boat to China. One year later I get a new phone sent to me by my carrier, a Sony Ericsson T226 (perhaps to keep me from switching carriers now that we have numnber portability in the U.S.) They've fixed the web button by creating a flatter button, but the camera functionality is now worse than before. So my question to you: are the problems with your phones (like mine) more a problem of the manufacturer, not the carrier? And if so, to what extent should the carrier be blamed for not doing a better job or for unveiling services before their hardware (and sometimes networks) are ready? Thanks again for your interesting posts. Alan IP: Logged |
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